[Third Party Win] WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [GAME OVER]

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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by Mendel »

Ultor wrote:Not to mention that it is impossible for a non-merchant role to have 13 inf.
Can you do the arithmetic for me, please?
3 rounds of gifts would average you at 4, but if you are wizard, you might be at 6, if you killed two guys with 3, that would already be 12, and one extra gift?

But yeah, I see what you are doing, you are trying to attract the low-influence players onto your wagon with the promise of sweet kill booty (which is an Ultor idea, because you really want to attract high-info people), and you make sure the guy gets merch'ed if the vote fails. Now if you were TD, that would be a good tactic, because we don't have a merch, but you do, so why not grab the points yourself?

-----

So anyway, shower thought, we do still have a power we can peddle, which is our minor special roleblock. If you want to endgame a faction, you want to kill two people on the same round (to bypass their disparity), and for that, you need roleblock to get past those immunities and tough. Except that won't work on DFalls, since their passive is to be unblockable. So for TD, it's either join them, or lynch them. :think:
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by Ultor »

Mendel wrote:3 rounds of gifts would average you at 4, but if you are wizard, you might be at 6, if you killed two guys with 3, that would already be 12, and one extra gift?
We don't know how he got it, if u refer to his first game post (ISO#2) you can actually tell he was asking his DF teammates to peek him. This means atleast 1 DF connection was formed at R1 and with him being a merchant, he probably stole from someone at R1 aswell. We can guess all day but the only logical explanation of how he reached this number of inf would mostly be based on his role, the merchant of DF. That's the reason I didn't wonna put my vote on AnOddGuy because the chances of him being DF's Knight(defender) or even assassin(who can also retaliate) are much higher than grey's. This is why its a much better vote.
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by UnwaveringGrey »

I'm not trying to get people to Lynch (or not Lynch) anyone in specific Mendel. I'm just trying to get us organized and voting on someone for good reasons, as opposed to just having a bunch of people go "uhh... I guess I need to vote someone. Let's pick a name out of a hat" because they don't have any Intel.
Oh, and there's a bit of confirmation that my claim of Ultor's role is correct. He didn't say "I'm not Ret, Grey is just an idiot". He started attacking me because based on my influence total and an argument that I might be merchant. Of course, the argument is completely wrong, by this point with lucky gifting it's possible to have way more than the 13 that he arrived at, and it's still realistically possible to have more than 13 with the help of a merchant. But that's all a moot point, because that's not my influence total. And it certainly won't be after this round either, after every merchant in the game steals from me "just in case" XD
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by UnwaveringGrey »

That first post was about the DF arsonist mechanic, right? I think you really underestimate how much I like arsonist mechanics is all. I love cult mechanics too, but I didn't see any cult leader style abilities in this game so I didn't comment on it.
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by Ultor »

UnwaveringGrey wrote:I'm not trying to get people to Lynch (or not Lynch) anyone in specific Mendel. I'm just trying to get us organized and voting on someone for good reasons, as opposed to just having a bunch of people go "uhh... I guess I need to vote someone. Let's pick a name out of a hat" because they don't have any Intel.
Oh, and there's a bit of confirmation that my claim of Ultor's role is correct. He didn't say "I'm not Ret, Grey is just an idiot". He started attacking me because based on my influence total and an argument that I might be merchant. Of course, the argument is completely wrong, by this point with lucky gifting it's possible to have way more than the 13 that he arrived at, and it's still realistically possible to have more than 13 with the help of a merchant. But that's all a moot point, because that's not my influence total. And it certainly won't be after this round either, after every merchant in the game steals from me "just in case" XD
"Lucky gifting" does not get you 13 inf. We know that there were 7 connections made in R1, so 14 people knew atleast 1 teammate. With this in mind, the gifting strategy changed, you don't simply gift a random person, you send it over to your teammate. Even if you made 2 connections at R1, it is still not enough to get you to 13. You have not denied my accusation on AnOddGuy being your teammate which pretty much proved your realm at this point. I have not denied your assumption of me being a reti nor do I confirm it- the only realm that I don't belong to would be TD which is proven by my stance against Mendel and Blaze.
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by Emziek »

Getting major DF reads on UnwaveringGrey, due to his reluctancy to vote AnOddGuy.
Also from his ISO we can determine he isn't TD/SS, Which leaves DF/BF/Retri as the only plausiable realms, Retri being the least likely and DF being the most. Now getting the merchant of either DF or BF killed sounds like a good deal to me.

[vote UnwaveringGrey]

Code: Select all

Katika_VS - 1 - AnOddGuy
AnOddGuy - 2 - Wertydoo, Arsenic
Ultor - 1 - UnwaveringGrey
UnwaveringGrey- 2 - Ultor, Emziek
No Vote - 13 - Katika VS, Patrick, MMage, Emziek, Cruxell, WaywardVole, Mystic, Cap_H, Lawliet, Mendel, Maki, Numble
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by Emziek »

I missed this when I wrote my first post, UnwaveringGrey outed Ultor as Retribution which means Retribution isn't his realm either. All things considered UnwaveringGrey has only something to gain out of all of this if he is either DF or BF. BF in the event he has infiltrated the DF realm.
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by Emziek »

@Everyone: Ultor actually made a few good points this round, don't dismiss his arguements at first glance.

Do note how UnwaveringGreys entire defence boils down to "Lul Luck xD"
UnwaveringGrey wrote:I'm not trying to get people to Lynch (or not Lynch) anyone in specific Mendel. I'm just trying to get us organized and voting on someone for good reasons, as opposed to just having a bunch of people go "uhh... I guess I need to vote someone. Let's pick a name out of a hat" because they don't have any Intel.
Oh, and there's a bit of confirmation that my claim of Ultor's role is correct. He didn't say "I'm not Ret, Grey is just an idiot". He started attacking me because based on my influence total and an argument that I might be merchant. Of course, the argument is completely wrong, by this point with lucky gifting it's possible to have way more than the 13 that he arrived at, and it's still realistically possible to have more than 13 with the help of a merchant. But that's all a moot point, because that's not my influence total. And it certainly won't be after this round either, after every merchant in the game steals from me "just in case" XD
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by UnwaveringGrey »

It's a stretch to call it a defense. It's a statement of fact. It's difficult to have 13 influence but definitely not impossible. It involves a little luck in R0 and early connections. But again, since Ultor's pulled that number out of thin air my arguing counterpoint is purely academic anyway.

I think you're missing the point here. The Crux of my argument is that the best use of this round's lynch is to either force the SS major or to stop Ret from using the information that I made public to link up. I'm not saying DF isn't a threat. Believe me, with a major special like that they are. But are they the threat to deal with this round?

Emziek has made commendable use of the isolate button to figure out some likely realms for me. Do the same if you want. But then think, even with this information coming from a member of whatever realm you decide I'm a part of does that make it any less true?
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by Emziek »

Right so the current lynch options, using the information available to the public at the time are the following:

AnOddOne(DF)
Lynches a DF who has been peeked by 2 different players (Werty and Cap_H)

UnwaveringGrey(DF/BF)
Lynches a very likely to be Merchant of either DF or BF realm

Katika(SS)
Forces SS major

Ultor(Retri)
Lynches a Retribution member who has been peeked by DF and/or BF (UnwaveringGrey)
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by Ultor »

UnwaveringGrey wrote:Ultor's pulled that number out of thin air my arguing counterpoint is purely academic anyway.
Its not "out of thin air." What makes your peek so 'real'?
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by Cruxell »

We have a perfect opportunity this round to either lynch a confirmed SS member or get rid of their major. If we were to vote for Katika, who is an undoubtedly confirmed SS member, we would eliminate an enemy. Well, at least most of the players of the game would. Don't listen to the scarce minority who will defend Katika with empty arguments.

If they use their major to protect Katika they would lose their strongest power in the game. It is to my understanding that the realm had been balanced in a way that some abilities had been lessened in order to create such a powerful major. The hosts have confirmed this as well. It is even better for us that they use the major now then later in the game when there are no second chances.

We don't know the alignment of the other players who have been suggested for lynch. Retribution, Desolate Falls and Barren Frosts are their potential realms, but we've got nothing to go on from but players' peek claims. With Katika, we can be completely certain what her realm is. Why waste such an opportune time to increase the strength of most realms in the game?

With this said as well as the points raised by other players, it is safest at this point to lynch Katika. [vote Katika VS].

The tally seems to have been corrupted for quite a while now. Whoever is gonna fix it should add the votes of Mendel and me, as well as all other votes which were forgotten.
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by Emziek »

Why take the risk of getting hit by their Major special instead of taking out Katika the safe way through NKs and Night actions? Each and every realm has the risk of being retaliated against by their special if we force a Katika lynch.
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by WaywardVole »

My only problem with the Katika vote is the seeming assumption that lynching her will force SS to use their special, which is far from guaranteed. Given that, what are the other reasons she's the best choice?
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Re: WW XXVII: The Remnants of Boswell [Round 3 Day ends 21:00 GMT Thursday]

Post by Cruxell »

WaywardVole wrote:My only problem with the Katika vote is the seeming assumption that lynching her will force SS to use their special, which is far from guaranteed. Given that, what are the other reasons she's the best choice?
They will use it. They can't risk being brought down to two players. If that happens, they won't be able to use their special at all.
And if they don't use it, we'll get rid of a confirmed SS member. It's a win-win situation.
If somebody knows what went wrong with the tally, we'd appreciate if you fixed it. I can't find the discrepancy and yet Mendel's vote seems to have been removed from the tally.
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