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#22 (ISO #1)  Re: Mafia XXVIII: Revenge
[In]

Wed Jun 15, 2016 11:25 am Profile Send private message
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#41 (ISO #2)  Re: Mafia XXVIII: Revenge
I visited HATER's house last night, and besides the fact that he owned a big mansion with tons of concubines attending him, he also smelled of cigar and vodka. On his walls hung weapons, which to me, seemed kind of real. After all, there were traces of gunpowder on the ground. In his backyard, there were some weird and scary people in black costumes. They cursed and raged, truly a bad company. And when I saw them, they tipped their hats and gave me the death stare. But ye know, while I questioned his lifestyle, I thought to myself that anybody could live like this. Just because he has some bad hobbies doesn't make him a bad guy, right? But you see, that's where I was mistaken. Because all of a sudden he whispered in my ears: "This is my mansion." I didn't understand what he meant at first. But he continued... "It's all over now..." As he left through the window into the dark forest, I understood completely well what kind of person HATER was. I therefore encourage everyone to:

[Vote HATER] (not day)

Because it's never over.

Wed Jun 15, 2016 9:58 pm Profile Send private message
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#54 (ISO #3)  Re: Mafia XXVIII: Revenge
Alright, based on my actions R0 I'm confirmed Non-Mafia / Non-deputy. Basically any town role but the Deputy.

This is what the H0st stated page 3:
Quote:
In the first round, Round 0, you cannot vote if you are not either a mafia member or the deputy, you don't have anything to do in this first round.


I, however, decided to vote against HATER sorry :(. But apparently my vote didn't count. The host, new as he is, made a mistake by revealing the following information:

Quote:
This is R0, there's no voting in R0 lelz


Since he knew my role he thought it to be a good reminder to tell me I couldn't vote. And since HATER is still alive that's proven. But he didn't keep in mind what this disclosure's potential consequences was.

With this in mind I'd like to ask everyone for a role claim.

Thu Jun 16, 2016 9:31 am Profile Send private message
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#57 (ISO #4)  Re: Mafia XXVIII: Revenge
Dear Hater, K0ntra has clearly stated he planned on hosting a game similar to Werewolf and from this perspective, it makes absolute sense that the game mechanics could be different. Anyway, I was mistaken and this should nullify my confirmation as a town member. On the other hand, you are clearly pulling a Mafia card on me right now. What you have said up to now makes all perfect sense. That I should have known better than to do what I did. This is something both Town members and Mafia can accuse me for. However, you have a tendency not to entertain every perspective when you are Mafia, which appears to be the case right now. In other words, you have failed to take into account the rashness of my actions. As a Mafia member there would be no way I'd be this sloppy and you know it. After all, you use the argument of me being an experienced player, right? With that in mind I believe you are doing your utmost to avoid me from getting any claims, because you realize the threat it would hold. Therefore by lynching me on rational grounds you can avoid the suspicion of being lynched tomorrow, it was justified after all, wasn't it? Everyone, my greatest suspicion right now is on HATER.

Thu Jun 16, 2016 11:55 am Profile Send private message
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#60 (ISO #5)  Re: Mafia XXVIII: Revenge
[Vote HATER]

Thu Jun 16, 2016 7:38 pm Profile Send private message
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#69 (ISO #6)  Re: Mafia XXVIII: Revenge
The people who vote me should reconsider the two major flaws in HATER's reasoning.

(1) He clearly doesn't want any progress. He wants the town's development to stagnate.

Quote:
So, logically, claiming villager is completely null, and trusting people for making an essentially pointless claim actually hurts the village... Claiming villager adds absolutely no new information to the mix -- and because it's pointless noise, it hinders real investigative work from being done... tl;dr: People can lie, claiming villager is at best pointless (since everyone including mafia will do it round 1), and at worst somewhat harmful because it clouds judgement and contributes to useless noise.


Quote:
My advice to new players who may have found themselves with a Tracker, Watcher, Doctor, or Cop role: TRUST NO-ONE with your role. Honestly, the amount of games that are thrown just because someone accidentally trusts a mafia with valuable information are too many to count. Play it SAFE, especially the first two rounds when you have no info.


His reasoning seems promising at first glance, but take another look at the setup:

Code:
7x Vanilla Villager
1x Deputy
1x Doctor
1x Tracker
1x Watcher

1x Goon
1x Don
1x Godfather


Town has the advantage both in numbers as well as in terms of Power Roles. People have the misconception that it's the power itself in the power roles which is important, and while there is some truth to that, its greatest merit is its name. Its ability to claim a name and either be it true or false. There's only one of its kind, it's a unique role. Therefore I attempted to create a situation where we could get this very start kicked off. Anyhow, the important part is to realize that it's safer for the town when the power roles unite early on rather than believing they should hide themselves, targeting people at random just to get picked off by the Mafia's night kills. This, if anything, is detrimental to the town. I would have expected HATER to do this if he was a Town Member, yet he tries to do the very opposite by using sound and convincing logic, something he typically do as a Mafia Member. As said before, his biggest flaw is that while his reasoning works, he reasons differently when playing Town or Mafia. He entertains all perspectives as a Town Member but only a certain few, the most suitable for his agenda, as a Mafia, which is the case right now.

(2) The hypocrisy in his arguments against me.

Quote:
Therefore, since SiX...
2. Has the ability and experience to easily figure out the problem with the assumption "lol only power roles and mafia can vote on r0", which anyone who's played the game more than once or twice (let alone as many times as SiX has!) would be able to quickly recognize that assumption as false


He uses the word experience to argue against me. He claims that I'm experienced enough to:

Quote:
1. Knew what he was doing at the time


Yet he only takes his argument this far. He doesn't consider the perspective that experience goes both ways. I'm experienced enough to know my actions would lead to a situation like this and I'd not have done it as a Mafia Member. And anyone who go with their gut feeling, will realize, that I'm a Town Member at this point.

As said before, HATER failed to entertain this perspective and only pushed the one comfortable for himself. Typical Scum.

Fri Jun 17, 2016 10:55 am Profile Send private message
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Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2011 4:30 pm
#81 (ISO #7)  Re: Mafia XXVIII: Revenge
I'm too lazy to check up the games I've played with HATER (kudos to you if you really checked them) but there's one thing you have forgotten to take into account. The games I myself have hosted. I do observe the players participating and I've noticed you play differently when you are a Mafia than when you are a Town member. And I've also played on the same team as you (which you did mention). So your process is correct but your conclusion is not. I don't have zero experience with your plays as a Mafia.

Secondly, don't listen to HATER. HATER realizes he will get lynched next round for lynching me. That's why he tries to switch the vote from me, so that he won't be held accountable. If you look at what he just wrote:

Quote:
"So, first off: there's a huge bandwagon on SiX with little to no resistance from anyone else. This massive imbalance makes me seriously doubt whether he's actually mafia -- I feel like if he was, his team would be defending him."


Pay close attention to what he's saying.

If you entertain the thought that I am Mafia, with only 2 teammates around, the only one who has defended me is Numble. Yet HATER claims there has been little to no resistance, despite the fact that there's only 3 mafia in total (Six, Numble and X). Basically 1 / 2 of my teammates did defend me, and that does not equal little to no resistance. But HATER knows he cannot push a lynch on Numble (who is Town) once I flip Town.

Furthermore, it would make little sense for a Mafia to defend me, since if I do flip Mafia, they would be lynched tomorrow. With this mindset, HATER should push a lynch on me and lynch Numble tomorrow. But HATER knows he cannot push a lynch on Numble (who is Town) once I flip Town. No, he would be lynched himself.

And not to forget, HATER suggests the mafia should be protecting me rather than voting against me. That would be truly detrimental. The Mafia should vote against me and wait for a Town member to protect me so that the Town member would be lynched tomorrow.

HATER realizes he will be lynched himself tomorrow if he lynches me today and because of that he tries to pull away from this bandwagon by voting an afk. He also tries to avoid being lynched today by attempting to rub elbows with me who accuse him.

Quote:
So, although I think SiX has extremely faulty logic -- I think there's a decent chance for him to be innocent.


Fri Jun 17, 2016 2:27 pm Profile Send private message
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Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2011 4:30 pm
#206 (ISO #8)  Re: Mafia XXVIII: Revenge
Too short a game for my taste. A pity that some of the people had to afk, but I guess these things (always) happen here on nD. Has there been one single game without at least 1 modkill? Perhaps there has been in the immemorial times.

Sun Jun 19, 2016 7:49 pm Profile Send private message
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Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2011 4:30 pm
#210 (ISO #9)  Re: Mafia XXVIII: Revenge
viewtopic.php?f=116&t=26141

Sun Jun 19, 2016 8:09 pm Profile Send private message
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